RangerWickett
Legend
This thread - Piloting/Driving Combat in RPGs is No Fun! - had a core point that a big problem with vehicle combat in RPGs is that usually only one player makes any meaningful choices. There's a fair bit of dice rolling that doesn't really affect the narrative. Since 5E is all about resolving things quickly with rulings instead of rules, I was curious how best to do naval combat in 5E without falling into that same trap.
I know the Ghosts of Saltmarsh adventure has a naval combat section, but it felt too fiddly for D&D 5E's design conceits.
I'm considering two ways to do naval combat in D&D 5E. I am hoping you might offer me some feedback, please.
Option One - Ships as Monsters
Ships use a statblock basically just like a monster. They have HP, attacks, movement, saves. The only real difference is that the scale is one square per 100 feet, and each round is one minute. Medium ships are 1 square (100 feet). Large ships are 2 squares, and Huge ships 3, Gargantuan 4. Your average ship has speed 400 to 600.
The PCs pick a captain who 'controls' the ship and plays it like a monster. They pick an ability score to represent their style of command. Also, their stat bonus determines how many 'officer actions' the ship can benefit from each turn. (So a stoic dwarf captain might pick Constitution. If his Con score is 18, the ship can benefit from 4 actions per turn.)
Str provides a bonus to combat maneuvers and to ship attacks at point blank range.
Dex provides a bonus to ship AC and to checks to avoid difficult terrain.
Con grants the ship temporary HP each turn.
Int makes it easier to score critical hits on opposing ships.
Wis provides a bonus to initiative.
Cha grants a bonus to the ship's saving throws.
Then each PC (up to the limit based on the captain's stat) can take one action per naval round to help the ship. You could make a Vehicle skill check to basically do combat maneuvers (you can drive an enemy ship into bad terrain, or ram to capsize, or grapple for a boarding action). Concealment might be hard to get, but you can try to Hide. You could also Dash or Dodge, or Disengage to avoid the opportunity attacks of a kraken. Maybe there'd be a check to try to repair a damaged component (but repairing damage should be harder than inflicting it).
The ship gets its own attacks automatically, but you might make use your action and make an attack roll to try to score a critical hit to mess with a ship component, or even to hit a specific creature on the other ship.
Once the ships end a turn adjacent, you end the 'naval combat' portion and switch to tactical combat. If one ship succeeded a maneuver to 'grapple,' they decide where to position their ship relative to the other, but have to be adjacent. Otherwise the ships start twenty feet apart. (This part I'm not sure about.)
Pros of this idea? It plays out naval combat with rules very similar to existing D&D.
Cons of this idea? One captain gets to have most of the fun. There might not be enough meaningful options for the players to choose from.
Option Two - Set the Parameters of the Battle
Three steps, all abstracted.
First, the game master determines if there's any chance to avoid a combat. If so, the commander of each side makes an opposed check, each using whatever ability score they want. The game master might impose disadvantage if one side is slower or in a bad position, or grant advantage if they have a clever idea. The winner decides if there's a combat.
Second, if there's a combat, the commanders again make opposed checks, but can use different ability scores. The winner decides how the ships are arranged. Are they side by side for a boarding action? Separated by a small gap? Are two ships pincering another, or did perhaps one ship manage to split the enemies so it's only facing one while the other slowly approaches.
Third, each ship gets one attack (with some really scary ships getting two). If there are multiple ships on a side, you choose where you damage goes. Damage doesn't mean Hit Points, though. If you hit, you inflict some condition on the enemy ship: a fire that is rapidly spreading, a teetering mast, a strike below the water line that causes the ship to list, or damage to some special component like a wizard's study or something.
Then the boarding action happens. Each side gets special benefits based on the ability score or scores their commander used for their checks. The main benefit is to place terrain, which can be on either ship, or even in the water.
Str - Place 12 squares of hazardous terrain - like shattered beams or fires that can cause damage if you move through the area, or firedust that can explode if damaged
Dex - After seeing where the enemies are but before rolling initiative, three characters on your side can use their full movement, perhaps leaping between ships or moving to cover.
Con - Place 12 squares that can provide cover, like fallen debris or stacks of crates.
Int - Place 12 squares that provide concealment, like drifting smoke or loose sails.
Wis - Place 12 squares of difficult terrain, like cracked deck planks or mats of seaweed that washed ashore.
Cha - After seeing where the enemies are but before rolling initiative, three characters on the other side are immobilized on the first turn of combat, perhaps from suppressing fire pinning them down or a confusion about whether they're supposed to attack.
Pros of this idea? Really fast to resolve, lets the players naturalistically collaborate to tweak the battlefield. Quirky.
Cons of this idea? Player choices don't influence the 'ship to ship' part of the battle that much. It's detached from existing game mechanics.
---
Any thoughts?
I know the Ghosts of Saltmarsh adventure has a naval combat section, but it felt too fiddly for D&D 5E's design conceits.
I'm considering two ways to do naval combat in D&D 5E. I am hoping you might offer me some feedback, please.
Option One - Ships as Monsters
Ships use a statblock basically just like a monster. They have HP, attacks, movement, saves. The only real difference is that the scale is one square per 100 feet, and each round is one minute. Medium ships are 1 square (100 feet). Large ships are 2 squares, and Huge ships 3, Gargantuan 4. Your average ship has speed 400 to 600.
The PCs pick a captain who 'controls' the ship and plays it like a monster. They pick an ability score to represent their style of command. Also, their stat bonus determines how many 'officer actions' the ship can benefit from each turn. (So a stoic dwarf captain might pick Constitution. If his Con score is 18, the ship can benefit from 4 actions per turn.)
Str provides a bonus to combat maneuvers and to ship attacks at point blank range.
Dex provides a bonus to ship AC and to checks to avoid difficult terrain.
Con grants the ship temporary HP each turn.
Int makes it easier to score critical hits on opposing ships.
Wis provides a bonus to initiative.
Cha grants a bonus to the ship's saving throws.
Then each PC (up to the limit based on the captain's stat) can take one action per naval round to help the ship. You could make a Vehicle skill check to basically do combat maneuvers (you can drive an enemy ship into bad terrain, or ram to capsize, or grapple for a boarding action). Concealment might be hard to get, but you can try to Hide. You could also Dash or Dodge, or Disengage to avoid the opportunity attacks of a kraken. Maybe there'd be a check to try to repair a damaged component (but repairing damage should be harder than inflicting it).
The ship gets its own attacks automatically, but you might make use your action and make an attack roll to try to score a critical hit to mess with a ship component, or even to hit a specific creature on the other ship.
Once the ships end a turn adjacent, you end the 'naval combat' portion and switch to tactical combat. If one ship succeeded a maneuver to 'grapple,' they decide where to position their ship relative to the other, but have to be adjacent. Otherwise the ships start twenty feet apart. (This part I'm not sure about.)
Pros of this idea? It plays out naval combat with rules very similar to existing D&D.
Cons of this idea? One captain gets to have most of the fun. There might not be enough meaningful options for the players to choose from.
Option Two - Set the Parameters of the Battle
Three steps, all abstracted.
First, the game master determines if there's any chance to avoid a combat. If so, the commander of each side makes an opposed check, each using whatever ability score they want. The game master might impose disadvantage if one side is slower or in a bad position, or grant advantage if they have a clever idea. The winner decides if there's a combat.
Second, if there's a combat, the commanders again make opposed checks, but can use different ability scores. The winner decides how the ships are arranged. Are they side by side for a boarding action? Separated by a small gap? Are two ships pincering another, or did perhaps one ship manage to split the enemies so it's only facing one while the other slowly approaches.
Third, each ship gets one attack (with some really scary ships getting two). If there are multiple ships on a side, you choose where you damage goes. Damage doesn't mean Hit Points, though. If you hit, you inflict some condition on the enemy ship: a fire that is rapidly spreading, a teetering mast, a strike below the water line that causes the ship to list, or damage to some special component like a wizard's study or something.
Then the boarding action happens. Each side gets special benefits based on the ability score or scores their commander used for their checks. The main benefit is to place terrain, which can be on either ship, or even in the water.
Str - Place 12 squares of hazardous terrain - like shattered beams or fires that can cause damage if you move through the area, or firedust that can explode if damaged
Dex - After seeing where the enemies are but before rolling initiative, three characters on your side can use their full movement, perhaps leaping between ships or moving to cover.
Con - Place 12 squares that can provide cover, like fallen debris or stacks of crates.
Int - Place 12 squares that provide concealment, like drifting smoke or loose sails.
Wis - Place 12 squares of difficult terrain, like cracked deck planks or mats of seaweed that washed ashore.
Cha - After seeing where the enemies are but before rolling initiative, three characters on the other side are immobilized on the first turn of combat, perhaps from suppressing fire pinning them down or a confusion about whether they're supposed to attack.
Pros of this idea? Really fast to resolve, lets the players naturalistically collaborate to tweak the battlefield. Quirky.
Cons of this idea? Player choices don't influence the 'ship to ship' part of the battle that much. It's detached from existing game mechanics.
---
Any thoughts?
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