Augury and Divination (or, Annoying your God to death)

[der_kluge]

So, I was thinking about the Augury spell, and Divination, it's more powerful cousin.

It seems to me, that in real life, if you had access to either of these spells, that pretty much every decision in life would be based on the results from them.

Augury will tell you "weal" or "woe" (good or bad) about an immediate action that you will take. An immediate action might be "do I order the fish, or the steak?" Or, "should I go to work today?"

Divination would be more long-term. "Should I quit my job and find a new one?" Or, "Is this girl right for me?"


I'm fairly certain that if I were a cleric, and had access to these spells, I'd make darn sure I completely exhausted myself of them everyday, and I'd become completely helpless when faced with a dilemna after my spell slots had been burned up.

Things like "God, is this milk any good?"
or
"Oh Pelor, should I take the highway to work, or the backway?"
or
"Your holiness, what I forget my umbrella today?"
or
"Lord, paper or plastic?"


Or long-term questions like "Should I stay at my current job, and hope that I don't get laid off?", or "Is moving to Minneapolis the right decision?" Or, "Is a Hyundai the right car for me?"

What kinds of questions would you be asking?

 

[Beelzebub]

Oh St. Cuthbert, why is it that drive-thru ATMs have brail (sp?) on their keys?

 

[Voadam]

I forget are there xp costs for these spells? (I don't play clerics)

 

[coyote6]

Augury & divination only really deal with questions about actions (a "specific goal, event, or activity"). "If I take the highway to work today, what will happen?" works, but "Is this milk any good?" doesn't. ("What happens if I drink this milk?" might work). To play 20 questions properly, you need commune (and a spare 100 xp).

Augury only peers a half-hour into the future, so "steak or fish" might be beyond it; divination works only a week into the future, so answers to questions about relocating to Minneapolis could be sadly short-term -- the first week's great, but when the meteor wipes out the whole metropolitan area on day 9, oops. Divination also costs 25 gp (IIRC) a pop, which might tend to limit its day-to-day usefullness for minor things.

 

[Craer]

What question would I ask? Why, the eternal one, of course.

Oh Moradin, praised be ye, which is the right choice?

Count Chocula or Lucky Charms?

-Craer

 

[Zogg]

Yes, there are lots of spells in DnD that you have to kinda ignore sometimes in order to play the game. For instance, why wouldn't a couple of clerics open up a tavern and just "create food and water" three times a day to make a living? There are many others that could effectively break the real-world troubles of general living, but you have to look past them.

In our campaign our DM limits augury/divination/commune spells in a way that questions must actually concern the deity. For instance, a god of war would not give information about the benefits of opening a trapped treasure chest (whereas a god of thievery or crafting would). A deity of beauty would only answer questions about diplomacy or social concerns, but would ignore questions about anything else.

I think this better illustrates ways such spells can be used - this way gods and goddesses will not forever be pestered with tedious questions of their mortal followers.

 

[MaxKaladin]

What kinds of questions would you be asking?

Oh, Lord? Why hast thou stopped granting me Divination and Augury spells?

Lord?

Hello?

 

[DMScott]

I don't think any deity would have much trouble with answering all those auguries and divinations - probably has some snot-nosed young half-celestial intern to do most of the grunt work. The problem the Cleric will run into is he only gets so many spells/day, so he does need to prioritize. If he wants to blow them all figuring out what to eat for breakfast and what outfit to wear, that might not be an optimal use of limited resources. But at least the intern will get to knock off work early.

On a more serious note, in a D&D world a church/ruler/noble/etc. certainly would be making use of divination spells, within the limits of their means. Taking that sort of thing into account can add some authenticity to interactions with those sorts of NPCs.

 

[der_kluge]

This is all very amusing, but you guys are missing the point. What kinds of questions would you be asking on a day to day basis??

And for the record, Zogg - I totally like that approach. I may have to use a similar rule in my game.

 

[Scion of Vyshaan]

The one time I got my wife to play in a high level campaign I was in, she played a cleric of Ilmater, and we were trying to find a kidnap victim protected from scrying and discern location (I think there was a mindblank involved). Anyway, so my uber-intelligent (and oh so humble) mage came up with the idea of having the cleric cast Commune to figure where the kidnapped girl was...

So the first commune goes something like this:
My Wife (MW): Oh great lord of suffering, are you doing well today?
DM: Yes
MW And oh wonderful easer of pain, are you busy at the moment?
DM: Yes
MW: Oh. Sorry to bother you.
And she promptly ends the spell.

Now my wizard, who really doesn't like clerics all that much, is tweaking (My wife loves to make my characters tweak). My wizard has her cast it again (another 100 XP down the tubes), but this time, we are unable to figure out a yes or no question to locate the girl. So I start frantically scribbling a flowchart of questions, which I hand to her for the third time. It went a little like this. (Remember this is in character, between to bickering characters, not how I actually talk to my wife).

MW: Oh great Ilmater, I apo...
Me: Just ask the friggin' questions
MW: Sorry, is the girl who formerly lived in Waterdeep in a house with a red roof in the dock districts with a mother named Emily but was taken forcefully from her home three days ago by skeletons within 500 miles of my current location
(At this point the DM gets a blank look on his face and asks for a ruler)
DM: No
MW: Is the girl who formerly lived in Waterdeep in a house with a red roof in the dock districts with a mother named Emily but was taken forcefully from her home three days ago by skeletons within 1000 miles of my current location
DM: <Expletive deleted>
MW: I'm sorry, my Lord, I did not hear you
DM: I said Yes

(This goes on until we pinpoint the position to between 650 to 675 miles. There are still more questions)

Me: Good, now get the bearing like we talked about.
MW: My Lord, is the girl who formerly lived in Waterdeep in a house with a red roof in the dock districts with a mother named Emily but was taken forcefully from her home three days ago by skeletons West of miles of my current location
DM: No
MW: My Lord, is the girl who formerly lived in Waterdeep in a house with a red roof in the dock districts with a mother named Emily but was taken forcefully from her home three days ago by skeletons South of miles of my current location
DM: Yes
MW: My Lord, is the girl who formerly lived in Waterdeep in a house with a red roof in the dock districts with a mother named Emily but was taken forcefully from her home three days ago by skeletons North or East of the 135 degree bearing line with regards to true north of my current location
DM: I don't know, I'm not the god of geometry
Me: Tell him he's the god of suffering and earning his pay, answer the friggin' question.

That was the first (of two) time I was smote by a god.

But he answered the question.