ARCANE LOCK versus KNOCK

[bweenie]

My understanding of the two spells is that a 3rd level wizard can KNOCK her way into a 20th level wizards ARCANE LOCKED door.

I don't see any spell of higher level that can be used for locking doors...I mean, you could get creative with illusions and transmutations for sure.

I was thinking of 'rectifying' this problem by requiring a caster check for KNOCK similar to DISPEL MAGIC, but with a +10 or +5 (otherwise knock would be pointless, and one should just memorize dispel magic...)

 

[Shard O'Glase]

considering arcane lock already stops anyway other than magic or destruction of the door cold I don't think it needs a boost. Knock basically is a limited dispel only vs arcane lock so it should be automatic. I realise it also opens ordinary locked doors but its purpose considering this is a team game mainly is getting rid of arcane lock, if it can't do that reliably it becomes mucho sucks butt.

 

[jodyjohnson]

Actually look at the CL limitation on size.

A 7th level caster's Arcane Lock can seal a 210sq ft door (7' wide, 30' high) which can't be opened by a 20th level casters Knock.

The key is using bigger doors. Now we have a good reason for all those huge doors in dungeons and big chests.

Arcane Lock
Abjuration
Level: Sor/Wiz 2
Components: V, S, M
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Range: Touch
Target: The door, chest, or portal touched, up to 30 sq. ft./level in size

Knock
Transmutation
Level: Sor/Wiz 2
Components: V
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Range: Medium (100 ft. + 10 ft./level)
Target: One door, box, or chest with an area of up to 10 sq. ft./level

 

[bweenie]

The key is using bigger doors. Now we have a good reason for all those huge doors in dungeons and big chests.

I suppose that I could live with that...
However, it still seems kind of wierd that a high level wizard can't keep a low level out of his pantry...

 

[bweenie]

considering arcane lock already stops anyway other than magic or destruction of the door cold I don't think it needs a boost.

It only gives a +10 DC to kicking in doors I thought...

 

[shilsen]

I suppose that I could live with that...
However, it still seems kind of wierd that a high level wizard can't keep a low level out of his pantry...

That's what the glyph trap which summons a pit fiend is for

 

[Kerrick]

That's what the glyph trap which summons a pit fiend is for

rofl

But seriously, I kind of favor opposed caster level checks, too, for spells like this and bestow curse. *shrug* I mean, if a 20th-level mage curses you, you shouldn't be able to say "no problem" and run to the local hedge priest (L3) and get it removed.

 

[Shard O'Glase]

It only gives a +10 DC to kicking in doors I thought...

I have yet to see a way to kick in a door that doesn't involve breaking it. The thing it should give a +10DC to is lock DC's. It alwasy bugged me that rogues(thieves even in earier editions)didn't have a way around this. I've let rogues disarm it like its a trap but I'm not sure that's by the rules. In fact I doubt it is since its not specifically mentioned like it is for glyphs(why cleric only) fire trap and the like.

 

[the Jester]

This spell from my campaign may be more what you're looking for.

WORD LOCK
Abjuration
Level: Sor/Wiz 6, Brd 6, Seals 6
Components: V
Casting Time: 1 action
Range: 10’
Target: 1 portal, chest or other closing device, up to 30 square feet/level
Duration: Permanent (D)
Saving Throw: None
Spell Resistance: No

This spell locks closed the target; thereafter it can only be opened with the proper spoken or sung word or phrase. Anyone who speaks or sings the song can generally open the closure; however, a bardic caster can tie in a perform check to the song (DC= caster’s perform check at time of casting).

Word lock is subject to break enchantment but not to dispel magic or knock. The closure itself can still be broken normally.

 

[tensen]

Knock is after all an extremely specialized spell.
It doesn't even dispel the arcane lock.. only suspend the operation.

A smart wizard word make ample use of this.
Door #1 with arcane lock... leads to inner door with arcane lock.. which leads to whatever they want. As long as they make sure things take sufficient time to deal with.. they can be assured that the knock happy wizard will be trapped by the now reset arcane locks... and has probably used up any memorized version of the spell.


But there are other instances of spells that don't really get better over time. So having arcane lock the way it is, isn't unexpected in the scheme of things.