Shard O'Glase
First Post
Merlion said:
usually I'm against alignments, but there is something satisfying in a fantasy game to have evil be a discernable force which can be detected and smited. Still it wont break my heart to see them go.
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D&D 3E/3.5 Alignment Restrictions in 3.5
- Thread starter Merlion
- Start date
usually I'm against alignments, but there is something satisfying in a fantasy game to have evil be a discernable force which can be detected and smited. Still it wont break my heart to see them go.
Merlion
First Post
I cant imagine a fantasy enviroment without well defined good and evil...since in my experince the majority of fantasy...and all good fantasy I have enountered...is about good against evil at its heart.
Of course I'm not of the mind that evil is that hard to discern in real life either but I digress.
Of course also the champion could be altered. And who knows we havent seen it yet...there might still be something similiar enough to be satisfying.
Of course I'm not of the mind that evil is that hard to discern in real life either but I digress.
Of course also the champion could be altered. And who knows we havent seen it yet...there might still be something similiar enough to be satisfying.
RigaMortus
Explorer
Berk said:
Let me guess, you watch a lot of WWF, don't you?
Note: Yes, I know it is WWE now, I'm just old skool and it will always be WWF to me.
Shard O'Glase
First Post
Berk said:
I disagree wrestling like the WWF rocks. It's like a soap opera on steroids. And it may be a mockery or "real" wrestling, but I consider the "fake" wrestlers absurdly talented athleates and decent performers.
SylverFlame
First Post
Someone posted earlier that the Knightly Code did not exist before some author dreamed it up. Not a chance. Look at words like "noble", and "gentle".
Check out their archaic (get a dictionary those who don't know what this is) meanings and you'll find that books could be written on them.
On top of this you have that awe inspiring concept of feudalism: oblige noblesse . Essentially the obligation of nobility. Nobles had to, due to their divinely attributed status, treat their surfs and peasants a certain way. It was the order of the day and it is what attributed to chivalry and such that came a little later. The concepts we see today (throwing your coat in a puddle for a lady to cross) are mutations of those old orders. These new ideas came about in the Renaissance.
What is my point? Well, it's basically that the knightly code makes sense for the paladin. However, this code is in itself not a reason for keeping the "paladin" class from being any alignment.
For instance, maybe a CE variant of the "paladin" class (we'll call it a Soul Blighter) has the god of slaughter for its patron. As such, the god of slaughter requires a senseless and brutal killing every week for the honour of serving it. There you go. New concept of the Paladin (with a new name) and a new alignment. As easy as that.
Check out their archaic (get a dictionary those who don't know what this is) meanings and you'll find that books could be written on them.
On top of this you have that awe inspiring concept of feudalism: oblige noblesse . Essentially the obligation of nobility. Nobles had to, due to their divinely attributed status, treat their surfs and peasants a certain way. It was the order of the day and it is what attributed to chivalry and such that came a little later. The concepts we see today (throwing your coat in a puddle for a lady to cross) are mutations of those old orders. These new ideas came about in the Renaissance.
What is my point? Well, it's basically that the knightly code makes sense for the paladin. However, this code is in itself not a reason for keeping the "paladin" class from being any alignment.
For instance, maybe a CE variant of the "paladin" class (we'll call it a Soul Blighter) has the god of slaughter for its patron. As such, the god of slaughter requires a senseless and brutal killing every week for the honour of serving it. There you go. New concept of the Paladin (with a new name) and a new alignment. As easy as that.
evilbob
Explorer
I'm not really a big fan of alignments, but I agree with the ppl who've said it's really more of a philosophy than an iron-clad rule system.
On the original topic of this thread, I'll say that I always thought part of the reason a Paladin was LG and LG -only- was less of a flavor issue (though that's there, too) and more of a balancing issue. Paladins get a lot of cool abilities - especially in their first few levels - so one of their "minuses" is that they can only behave in a very specific way in-game. And, if they ever fall outside of that code, they lose their abilities. To that end, I'd say the only way the Paladins could be allowed to have other alignments would be to take away some of their perks, to balance it out. (To reverse that, giving someone the option to take other alignments without removing some perks unbalances the character.)
And I also agree with everyone who said that D&D will most likely never change that.
On the original topic of this thread, I'll say that I always thought part of the reason a Paladin was LG and LG -only- was less of a flavor issue (though that's there, too) and more of a balancing issue. Paladins get a lot of cool abilities - especially in their first few levels - so one of their "minuses" is that they can only behave in a very specific way in-game. And, if they ever fall outside of that code, they lose their abilities. To that end, I'd say the only way the Paladins could be allowed to have other alignments would be to take away some of their perks, to balance it out. (To reverse that, giving someone the option to take other alignments without removing some perks unbalances the character.)
And I also agree with everyone who said that D&D will most likely never change that.
FreeTheSlaves
Adventurer
Afraid not evilbob, the game designers (Monte and co) spelt out that alignment androle playing requirements were not to be a balancing factor for unbalanced powers.
The fighter proves this because you can't really say the paladin is a more powerful class. Not anymore. Well you can say that but it wouldn't ring true.
Anyone remember the unearthed arcana cavalier? Merlion would be spitting if he saw how favoured the paladin used to be because of his code.
Gygax must have a soft spot for paladins because he let them function on way negative HPs, boost their stats each level, oh they also had d12 HD... That was a prime example of why you balance concrete (combat) bonuses with hinderances because the cavalier code was no harder to adhere to than the paladin code.
It would be like saying fighters have to use the best weapons and armour to defeat their foes.
The fighter proves this because you can't really say the paladin is a more powerful class. Not anymore. Well you can say that but it wouldn't ring true.
Anyone remember the unearthed arcana cavalier? Merlion would be spitting if he saw how favoured the paladin used to be because of his code.
Gygax must have a soft spot for paladins because he let them function on way negative HPs, boost their stats each level, oh they also had d12 HD... That was a prime example of why you balance concrete (combat) bonuses with hinderances because the cavalier code was no harder to adhere to than the paladin code.It would be like saying fighters have to use the best weapons and armour to defeat their foes.
