D&D 5E A slight tweak to the new UA spell: Chaos Bolt

[Hawk Diesel]

So as most everyone here know, there was a recent UA that provided some new cantrips and 1st level spells. One of the cooler one IMO was Chaos Bolt. It provided a neat new mechanic. All the way up until the end, when suddenly it fizzled out. Normally the spell deal 2d8 damage die. Most spells deal more of the same type of damage die when cast at higher levels, except Chaos Bolt, which gain 1d6 per spell level. Now I understand their reasoning. It allows you to differentiate the d8s for picking the damage type, and also places a limits on the jump to a new target when two of the same number are rolled. But I think they should have just went with it! That possibility to leap to a new target is the best part about the spell, and I think pumping it with a higher level slot should make that more likely. So I tweaked the spell a bit as follows. I'd appreciate your thoughts.

Chaos Bolt
1st-level evocation
Casting Time: 1 action
Range: 120 feet
Components: V, S
Duration: Instantaneous

You hurl an undulating, warbling mass of chaotic energy at one creature in range. Make a ranged spell attack against the target. On a hit, the target takes 2d8 damage. Choose one of the d8s. The number it rolled determines the type of damage, as shown below.

d8 - DamageType
1 - Acid
2 - Cold
3 - Fire
4 - Force
5 - Lightning
6 - Poison
7 - Psychic
8 - Thunder

If you roll the same number on both d8s, the chaotic energy leaps from the target to a different creature of your choice within 30 feet of it. Make a new attack roll against the new target, and make a new damage roll, which could cause the chaotic energy to leap again.

A creature can be targeted only once by this mass of chaotic energy.

At Higher Levels. When you cast this spell using a spell slot of 2nd level or higher, the initial target takes extra damage equal to 1d8 for each slot above 1st. You may choose the damage based on any d8 rolled. Regardless of the number of dice rolled, rolling two of the same number results in a leap to a new target. However, each leap deals one damage dice less, to a minimum of 2d8.

*****

I believe this new take allows greater flexibility and also encourages the spell to be better at doing the cool thing it is meant to do. What are your thoughts?

 

[Croesus]

Yep, I like your version better. Chaos bolt starts out with lower damage than comparable spells, e.g., chromatic orb. And since one has to cast it in a higher-level slot to increase the chances of getting a specific damage type and jumping to another creature, your change is not unbalanced. If anything, the spell still seems a bit weak, but also fun - rolling psychic against a raging barbarian would prompt cheers (or groans) from the players, depending on who gets hit.

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

At Higher Levels. When you cast this spell using a spell slot of 2nd level or higher, the initial target takes extra damage equal to 1d8 for each slot above 1st. You may choose the damage based on any d8 rolled. Regardless of the number of dice rolled, rolling two of the same number results in a leap to a new target. However, each leap deals one damage dice less, to a minimum of 2d8.

*****

I believe this new take allows greater flexibility and also encourages the spell to be better at doing the cool thing it is meant to do. What are your thoughts?

Your version is much cooler. It's cool enough to motivate me to actually do the (BOTE) math on how good it is instead of writing it off as "obviously bad when upcast."

Thanks to losing a die on each jump, the spell is not overpowered even against low-AC targets. I approve. I would allow your version of the spell for any sorcerer in my campaign.

BTW, I'm sure everyone is aware of this already but I'll mention it just in case: Chaos Bolt makes the Empowered Spell metamagic much better, good enough to maybe be worth using on a regular basis.

 

[Satyrn]

I find it aesthetically more pleasing simply for using only 1 die size. That's enough to get my thumbs up.

 

[TwoSix]

It's better than the original version, but I'm always leery of low level spells that scale too well. This goes from averaging a hair over 2d8 at 1st to 15d8 at 5th level. (ignoring hit chances).

Honestly, I'd like to see the spell have a much higher bounce chance, at least 40-50% for the initial bounce. Only 12.5% for the initial bounce, plus requiring a second hit, sucks.

 

[Hawk Diesel]

It's better than the original version, but I'm always leery of low level spells that scale too well. This goes from averaging a hair over 2d8 at 1st to 15d8 at 5th level. (ignoring hit chances).

Honestly, I'd like to see the spell have a much higher bounce chance, at least 40-50% for the initial bounce. Only 12.5% for the initial bounce, plus requiring a second hit, sucks.

This spell only does 6d8 using a 5th level spell slot. Where are you getting 15d8?

 

[TwoSix]

This spell only does 6d8 using a 5th level spell slot. Where are you getting 15d8?

6d8 + 93% chance of bouncing for 5d8 + (93% * 79%) 73% of bouncing for 4d8 + (93%*79*59%) 43% of bouncing for 3d8. There's the 2d8 as well, but that's such a low chance it barely adds to the damage.

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

It's better than the original version, but I'm always leery of low level spells that scale too well. This goes from averaging a hair over 2d8 at 1st to 15d8 at 5th level. (ignoring hit chances).

If you're counting that way, Scorching Ray at fifth level does 12d6, and you can fire them all at the same target, AND you don't take effectively triple disadvantage the way you do with Chaos Bolt on the fourth target. Hit chances become rather important in such an analysis.

Let's not even talk about the fact that Fireball V would be 40d8 in the same situation where Chaos Bolt V maxes out at 15d8 even if you hit on every single attack.

In practice, Chaos Bolt V is going to be about as good as Scorching Ray V, which is to say mediocre for the cost, much worse than Fireball. (But mediocre doesn't preclude "fun", which is what Chaos Bolt potentially brings to the table.)

Likewise Chain Lightning, at sixth level, does 10d8 to four targets, which is 40d8 (save for half) compared to Chaos Bolt VI's maximum of 21d8, which will in practice be closer to 12d8 or so.

 

[Croesus]

6d8 + 93% chance of bouncing for 5d8 + (93% * 79%) 73% of bouncing for 4d8 + (93%*79*59%) 43% of bouncing for 3d8. There's the 2d8 as well, but that's such a low chance it barely adds to the damage.

Your numbers are helpful - I hadn't realized how much the bounce chance increased with additional d8's. However, as Hemlock points out, that just means chaos bolt is not a horrible choice for upcasting. It's still not clearly superior to other options, and certainly not unbalanced.

 

[Xeviat]

Has anyone run the math on both versions?


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