I don't think people were saying it was the norm, but I think its fair to say that is was more common in decades past and there was a fair amount of bad DM advice that helped support it far longer than it needed to be. Some DMs figured it out for themselves and improved. Some DMs who were bad...
I've been open about at least two DMs I've known who I would categorize as adversarial. One was a long-time friend who was very manipulative and used the role of DM as a way to exert power over the group and another I briefly played with who was the proverbial killer DM. Both took advantage of...
It was also a rejection of The Hickman Revolution style of story focused play and embrace of The Dungeon as a duel of whits between DM and player. While it wasn't explicitly adversarial, it was keen on recreating the elements necessary for that type of adversarial element to thrive.
But yes...
And yet Gary is taken as The Word when it comes to how D&D should be played. The OSR started as "D&D as Gary intended". We had a whole blow up last summer about a book suggesting he was a little bit sexist and how what tarnished the legacy of Gygax. So I am not surprised that his flawed ideas on...
I want to believe you. I'm sure the silent majority of players are completely normal people having completely normal fun. But I'm of the opinion that a lot of the advice that floated though the community for a while was not made by or for those normal people. They were made by people who either...
I think you are trying to redefine what is being discussed.
Adversarial is not a play style. You are describing old school dungeon hack where the DM is taking on the primary role of challenging the players, but within the boundaries of fairness. The DM gives the players no favor, but isn't...
It certainly was more wide spread than the community was willing to admit. And a phenomenon not limited to D&D. The worst GM I've ever heard of (second hand) was Vampire Storyteller. Absolute killer DM who loved using antediluvians and werewolves to absolutely shred PCs.
People make that reference as if it's a gotcha. TMNT was a small indie comic when tortles first appeared. Their popularity exploded with the cartoon and toy line (1988). Further, tortles were a Mystara race and part of Basic until that line was ended. Outside of Red Steel and the ill fated...
It's also worth noting that a lot of "fans" of a given property don't actually like any specific version, but a Platonic Ideal of it.
Topic at hand: if the Dark Sun 5e book was literally word for word the 2e version reprinted, there would still be fans who complained they weren't getting...
Oh adventures should be interesting in both definitions, but I don't consider the interesting part gambling during char gen for a playable character.
But that's not what this thread is about. Carry on.