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[Very Long] Combat as Sport vs. Combat as War: a Key Difference in D&D Play Styles...
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<blockquote data-quote="Radiating Gnome" data-source="post: 5834506" data-attributes="member: 150"><p>I enjoy both COW and COS, and don't see them as mutually exclusive. I think they take some very different DMing to promote. </p><p></p><p>I think what players (and DMs) enjoy about the CoW is the creativity it involves -- most of the stories offered of those CoW moments cited in this thread are moments of player creativity. And, at the same time, great DM flexibility. </p><p></p><p>So, IMO, any time you have a choice to make, you have an opportunity to be creative. You can make an unusual or daring choice, or you can make a typical, pedestrian one. </p><p></p><p>4E created a much richer variety of choices within tactical encounters for PCs. The powers system alone is a major component of that. Every round a player is making choices about which powers to use, where to move, how to get there to avoid OAs, and so on. </p><p></p><p>That sort of creativity -- call it "small c creativity" although I don't want to belittle it -- has one primary advantage: It can be adjudicated by the game rules pretty handily, and does not require flexibility from the DM on the same scale that the CoW examples do. </p><p></p><p>I think there's important insight to be found there: CoS can be a whole lot easier on the DM, because by and large combat can run itself these days. </p><p></p><p>And, because 4e focuses so much attention on the encounter as the primary atomic unit of a game, it can be more difficult to create opportunities for that kind of CoW creativity within a 4e game. </p><p></p><p>I love 4e, and have since it's release. I think it's a superior game to 3.5. I also think it's a FAR better game for what I think it was intended to do -- create an entry game for new players and DMs. I don't think anyone would argue with me that it's far easier for a noob DM to pick up 4e and run it than it would be to pick up 3.5 and run it. It's not easy, but it 's easier. </p><p></p><p>BUT I think it's important to be aware of what the system does well and doesn't do well, and make sure that you're doing what you can to bridge those gaps. </p><p></p><p>In my case, I work to try to use skill challenges and other mechanics to build a stronger framework around the encounters -- and to make the story told by the encounters more interesting and cohesive. I try to make sure that there's something more at stake in encounters than just killing everything on the table that isn't a PC. </p><p></p><p>And it's not perfect. But I'm having fun.</p><p></p><p>-rg</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Radiating Gnome, post: 5834506, member: 150"] I enjoy both COW and COS, and don't see them as mutually exclusive. I think they take some very different DMing to promote. I think what players (and DMs) enjoy about the CoW is the creativity it involves -- most of the stories offered of those CoW moments cited in this thread are moments of player creativity. And, at the same time, great DM flexibility. So, IMO, any time you have a choice to make, you have an opportunity to be creative. You can make an unusual or daring choice, or you can make a typical, pedestrian one. 4E created a much richer variety of choices within tactical encounters for PCs. The powers system alone is a major component of that. Every round a player is making choices about which powers to use, where to move, how to get there to avoid OAs, and so on. That sort of creativity -- call it "small c creativity" although I don't want to belittle it -- has one primary advantage: It can be adjudicated by the game rules pretty handily, and does not require flexibility from the DM on the same scale that the CoW examples do. I think there's important insight to be found there: CoS can be a whole lot easier on the DM, because by and large combat can run itself these days. And, because 4e focuses so much attention on the encounter as the primary atomic unit of a game, it can be more difficult to create opportunities for that kind of CoW creativity within a 4e game. I love 4e, and have since it's release. I think it's a superior game to 3.5. I also think it's a FAR better game for what I think it was intended to do -- create an entry game for new players and DMs. I don't think anyone would argue with me that it's far easier for a noob DM to pick up 4e and run it than it would be to pick up 3.5 and run it. It's not easy, but it 's easier. BUT I think it's important to be aware of what the system does well and doesn't do well, and make sure that you're doing what you can to bridge those gaps. In my case, I work to try to use skill challenges and other mechanics to build a stronger framework around the encounters -- and to make the story told by the encounters more interesting and cohesive. I try to make sure that there's something more at stake in encounters than just killing everything on the table that isn't a PC. And it's not perfect. But I'm having fun. -rg [/QUOTE]
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[Very Long] Combat as Sport vs. Combat as War: a Key Difference in D&D Play Styles...
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