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Respect Mah Authoritah: Thoughts on DM and Player Authority in 5e
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<blockquote data-quote="Malmuria" data-source="post: 8434068" data-attributes="member: 7030755"><p>A term like "win condition" for me is most useful in describing games that once the conditions are met, the game is over. In basketball, you must a) have the higher score at b) the end of regulation. Then the game is over, one team wins, the other loses. You only keep playing if there is a tie, because (a) has not been met. Now maybe one player has a personal goal that they want to score at least 20 points, even if the team loses. They can describe that as a personal "win" if they want, but it doesn't by itself help settle the win conditions of the game. </p><p></p><p>IMO, the language of "wins" should be avoided in rpgs, especially with new players, because it generally connotes a zero-sum situation (and thus can produce adversarial play) and suggests that the game ends once the "win condition" is met. </p><p></p><p>Or to put it another way, via a made up example: I might decide that my character is looking for his long lost sibling. I would describe that sort of thing as a hook: a potential plot hook for the gm, and something to anchor my character in the world and give them a reason to get messed up with the other characters. Since you are collaborating with the gm and other players on a story, it's good to throw these things out there and be open to some of them getting taken up, and others being left aside. What are the stakes of calling this sort of thing a "win condition"? What does it add to our understanding of the game, or how it's played out?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Malmuria, post: 8434068, member: 7030755"] A term like "win condition" for me is most useful in describing games that once the conditions are met, the game is over. In basketball, you must a) have the higher score at b) the end of regulation. Then the game is over, one team wins, the other loses. You only keep playing if there is a tie, because (a) has not been met. Now maybe one player has a personal goal that they want to score at least 20 points, even if the team loses. They can describe that as a personal "win" if they want, but it doesn't by itself help settle the win conditions of the game. IMO, the language of "wins" should be avoided in rpgs, especially with new players, because it generally connotes a zero-sum situation (and thus can produce adversarial play) and suggests that the game ends once the "win condition" is met. Or to put it another way, via a made up example: I might decide that my character is looking for his long lost sibling. I would describe that sort of thing as a hook: a potential plot hook for the gm, and something to anchor my character in the world and give them a reason to get messed up with the other characters. Since you are collaborating with the gm and other players on a story, it's good to throw these things out there and be open to some of them getting taken up, and others being left aside. What are the stakes of calling this sort of thing a "win condition"? What does it add to our understanding of the game, or how it's played out? [/QUOTE]
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Respect Mah Authoritah: Thoughts on DM and Player Authority in 5e
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