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<blockquote data-quote="Schmoe" data-source="post: 7438687" data-attributes="member: 913"><p>I definitely agree about the dichotomy between being confined by or able to break the rules of reality, and good point about out of combat. Thanks!</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Again, 100% agree with these points. I've added a few options to address some of these in limited fashion, although I'm not sure if I've gone far enough. For example, Heroic Resilience allows a character the chance to make a second saving throw against an ongoing magical effect in the following round. Is it enough? I haven't seen it in play yet, and I'm leery of tilting too far in one direction. Close quarters fighting (AoO against all grapple attempts) should help characters avoid the peril of the many creatures with Improved Grab, but again, I don't know if that goes far enough.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I like the idea to make skills more generally useful, so that's something I'll think about. It would go a long way toward providing non-spellcasting classes more out of combat flexibility.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I don't really have a fix for this right now, but I'm not convinced it's the most important thing to solve right away.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>This, on the other hand, is huge. As I mentioned above, I have a few options I'm working with right now, but I'll need some in-game feedback before determining if it does enough.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Yes! I don't want want to focus just on damage, and as the OP says, I'm really looking for additional tactical options. A wizard's ability to, say, cast a Wall of Stone and completely divide the battlefield is pretty powerful. While a high-level martial shouldn't be able to raise a stone wall, maybe things like creating a kill zone with ranged attacks, or stunning all opponents in a limited area, or a frenzied charge with a free overrun+attack against everyone in your path, etc, would be sufficient to make a martial feel like they had some more influence over the tactical situation than just dealing damage. </p><p></p><p>As for overcoming environmental hazards, that's one area I haven't given much thought to. It seems that skills could help here (jump, climb, balance, escape artist, etc).</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Again, this is definitely what I would like to see.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>A high-level fighter (or paladin, or rogue, or ranger, or barbarian, or scout, or...) should be able to do things that truly amaze the common person without the aid of magic. </p><p></p><p>"Thorvald scrambled up the 10' wall and leaped across the 15' chasm to pull himself up onto a ledge above the floor, all the while dodging the flying sorcerer's bolts of enervation. He turned to face a rushing contingent of orcs but a slam of his hammer on the stone sent shards in a blinding spray, and they reeled backwards. Safe for the moment, Thorvald turned and made a flying leap to grapple the sorcerer and bring him crashing to the ground. He stood up from the crumpled corpse of mage and inspected his armor. Seeing that the kneeplates were scuffed, he cursed under his breath." - That's the stuff of heroes. </p><p></p><p>I don't know if I said it explicitly, but I'm not interested in nerfing spell-casters, so the solution is that the non-casters need some more options.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Schmoe, post: 7438687, member: 913"] I definitely agree about the dichotomy between being confined by or able to break the rules of reality, and good point about out of combat. Thanks! Again, 100% agree with these points. I've added a few options to address some of these in limited fashion, although I'm not sure if I've gone far enough. For example, Heroic Resilience allows a character the chance to make a second saving throw against an ongoing magical effect in the following round. Is it enough? I haven't seen it in play yet, and I'm leery of tilting too far in one direction. Close quarters fighting (AoO against all grapple attempts) should help characters avoid the peril of the many creatures with Improved Grab, but again, I don't know if that goes far enough. I like the idea to make skills more generally useful, so that's something I'll think about. It would go a long way toward providing non-spellcasting classes more out of combat flexibility. I don't really have a fix for this right now, but I'm not convinced it's the most important thing to solve right away. This, on the other hand, is huge. As I mentioned above, I have a few options I'm working with right now, but I'll need some in-game feedback before determining if it does enough. Yes! I don't want want to focus just on damage, and as the OP says, I'm really looking for additional tactical options. A wizard's ability to, say, cast a Wall of Stone and completely divide the battlefield is pretty powerful. While a high-level martial shouldn't be able to raise a stone wall, maybe things like creating a kill zone with ranged attacks, or stunning all opponents in a limited area, or a frenzied charge with a free overrun+attack against everyone in your path, etc, would be sufficient to make a martial feel like they had some more influence over the tactical situation than just dealing damage. As for overcoming environmental hazards, that's one area I haven't given much thought to. It seems that skills could help here (jump, climb, balance, escape artist, etc). Again, this is definitely what I would like to see. A high-level fighter (or paladin, or rogue, or ranger, or barbarian, or scout, or...) should be able to do things that truly amaze the common person without the aid of magic. "Thorvald scrambled up the 10' wall and leaped across the 15' chasm to pull himself up onto a ledge above the floor, all the while dodging the flying sorcerer's bolts of enervation. He turned to face a rushing contingent of orcs but a slam of his hammer on the stone sent shards in a blinding spray, and they reeled backwards. Safe for the moment, Thorvald turned and made a flying leap to grapple the sorcerer and bring him crashing to the ground. He stood up from the crumpled corpse of mage and inspected his armor. Seeing that the kneeplates were scuffed, he cursed under his breath." - That's the stuff of heroes. I don't know if I said it explicitly, but I'm not interested in nerfing spell-casters, so the solution is that the non-casters need some more options. [/QUOTE]
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