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If not death, then what?
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<blockquote data-quote="ninjayeti" data-source="post: 8706664" data-attributes="member: 6789120"><p>To my mind "death sucks" is the feature, not the bug (I say this as someone who plays more than DMs). The fact that it is unpleasant and even sometimes random is what makes me as a player invested in the game, particularly combat. Yes I have had some disappointing games when a beloved character died unexpectedly, but I have far, far more where my PC took a real risk and did something AWESOME. </p><p></p><p>In my experience as a player and DM I have never seen another "consequence" that worked well. They tend to be (as the OP points out) something that tramples your character concept like getting maimed or turned into a gnome. Otherwise they are some form of nominal consequence that is actually a nothingburger. The main examples I have seen are:</p><p></p><p>1) Captured. The only thing more boring than a dead PC is a captured PC. So this inevitably turns into RP being in a cell for 10 minutes and then a miraculous escape with all of your gear. </p><p></p><p>2) You work for me now. The PC either owes the bad guy who spared their life or the deity who brought them back from the dead. Now they have to ..... go on adventures for them. This is not a consequence, it is a plot hook. </p><p></p><p>3)"Loss." PCs fail in some objective, and maybe lose an NPC they cared about or something. Again, in my experience this just turns into the next plot hook to avenge x or redeem themselves. Sorry, that is not a consequence, that is Act One. </p><p></p><p>My buddy had a poker night a few years back where we just played for chips but no money. By the end of the night everyone was going "all in" every hand. The "consequences" of losing were so minimal that no one even cared it they won or lost. To my mind, this is the risk you run by trying to take PC death off the table as a consequence. Unless you can replace it with something that is actually meaningful to the players, you run a bigger risk of player apathy.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="ninjayeti, post: 8706664, member: 6789120"] To my mind "death sucks" is the feature, not the bug (I say this as someone who plays more than DMs). The fact that it is unpleasant and even sometimes random is what makes me as a player invested in the game, particularly combat. Yes I have had some disappointing games when a beloved character died unexpectedly, but I have far, far more where my PC took a real risk and did something AWESOME. In my experience as a player and DM I have never seen another "consequence" that worked well. They tend to be (as the OP points out) something that tramples your character concept like getting maimed or turned into a gnome. Otherwise they are some form of nominal consequence that is actually a nothingburger. The main examples I have seen are: 1) Captured. The only thing more boring than a dead PC is a captured PC. So this inevitably turns into RP being in a cell for 10 minutes and then a miraculous escape with all of your gear. 2) You work for me now. The PC either owes the bad guy who spared their life or the deity who brought them back from the dead. Now they have to ..... go on adventures for them. This is not a consequence, it is a plot hook. 3)"Loss." PCs fail in some objective, and maybe lose an NPC they cared about or something. Again, in my experience this just turns into the next plot hook to avenge x or redeem themselves. Sorry, that is not a consequence, that is Act One. My buddy had a poker night a few years back where we just played for chips but no money. By the end of the night everyone was going "all in" every hand. The "consequences" of losing were so minimal that no one even cared it they won or lost. To my mind, this is the risk you run by trying to take PC death off the table as a consequence. Unless you can replace it with something that is actually meaningful to the players, you run a bigger risk of player apathy. [/QUOTE]
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