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[Help Plz] Do grapple checks include penalties/bonuses from defenseive fighting, etc?
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<blockquote data-quote="reapersaurus" data-source="post: 1063015" data-attributes="member: 1194"><p>No, "in the place of" means you THINK they are not considered attacks.</p><p>If you have a WotC reference that specifically says they aren't attacks, than I'm all ears. Seriously.</p><p>As far as I can see, you are just hypothesizing (nothing wrong with that, BTW). However, you immediately contradict your blanket statement above, by specifiying the couple "special grappling options" that DO qualify as "attacks" in your eyes.</p><p></p><p>I don't see how you didn't just invalidate the SRD quote there.</p><p>IOW, the SRD said that "they take the place of your attack". </p><p>You conclude that means that grapples aren't attacks.</p><p>Then you point out 2 options that ARE attacks (Attack Your Opponent and Use Opponent's Weapon).</p><p>So you cannot use the "take the place of an attack" description to prove anything, since it's quite obvious that grapples can have an attack component. One must conclude that the "take the place of an attack" wording is just descriptive text, making it clear that one can't grapple and do normal attacks (especially full attacks).This hypothesis has no basis other than descriptive text that describes one as an "attack" and not another.</p><p></p><p>I am of the simplistic opinion that anything that does damage, is an attack.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="reapersaurus, post: 1063015, member: 1194"] No, "in the place of" means you THINK they are not considered attacks. If you have a WotC reference that specifically says they aren't attacks, than I'm all ears. Seriously. As far as I can see, you are just hypothesizing (nothing wrong with that, BTW). However, you immediately contradict your blanket statement above, by specifiying the couple "special grappling options" that DO qualify as "attacks" in your eyes. I don't see how you didn't just invalidate the SRD quote there. IOW, the SRD said that "they take the place of your attack". You conclude that means that grapples aren't attacks. Then you point out 2 options that ARE attacks (Attack Your Opponent and Use Opponent's Weapon). So you cannot use the "take the place of an attack" description to prove anything, since it's quite obvious that grapples can have an attack component. One must conclude that the "take the place of an attack" wording is just descriptive text, making it clear that one can't grapple and do normal attacks (especially full attacks).This hypothesis has no basis other than descriptive text that describes one as an "attack" and not another. I am of the simplistic opinion that anything that does damage, is an attack. [/QUOTE]
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[Help Plz] Do grapple checks include penalties/bonuses from defenseive fighting, etc?
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