Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
The
VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX
is coming! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions
[2e] Monster Mythology Update Project
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Cleon" data-source="post: 8188818" data-attributes="member: 57383"><p>Well if Number of Attacks were handled consistently in 2E we wouldn't be having this problem.</p><p></p><p>Early edition D&D's exception-based rules has many charms but ease of interpretation is not one of them!</p><p></p><p>Putting the ×2 last after a closing parenthesis was my preferred solution - as in "(hoof/hoof/horn)×2". I agree that sticking ×2 after each attack is just too clunky.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Well it's not just AD&D's Gods that sometimes get their Strength bonus on non-weapon melee range attacks like claws in early editions, there are a few monsters that play by their own rules even in 1E AD&D. The Daemons from <em>Fiend Folio</em> (1981) and Colchiln from <em>Mordenkainen's Magnificent Adventure</em> (1984) are the earliest examples that come to mind.</p><p></p><p>The Colchiln was doubly confusing since according to its description in WG5 it has a Strength bonus ON TOP OF a +3 base damage bonus ["<span style="font-size: 12px">strengths range from 18/01 to 18/00, but the creatures gain only the +3, +4, +5, or +6 damage bonus (add to the base ld6+3 points of damage)</span>"] while its encounter in that module has a Dmg stat that is a bit sloppily phrased ["<span style="font-size: 12px">Dmg 4-9 per claw, Str 18/75 but with no bonus to hit</span>"], since it'd be easy to see that 4-9 and think the 1d6+3 is just 1d6 base damage and +3 for its Strength 18/75.</p><p></p><p>If it gets 1d6+3 base damage from its adamantine claws plus +3 for Strength I'd prefer "Dmg 1d6+6 per claw, Str 18/75 but with no bonus to hit" there.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Yes, the 2e god-books that came out after <em>Legends & Lore</em> do become somewhat more consistent in presentation although there are still plenty of glitches - like Nobanion's Avatar in <em>Powers & Pantheons</em> who's lion form claw/claw/rear claws/bite don't get ×2 attacks despite being a 23rd level paladin and 19th level ranger.</p><p></p><p>As you pointed out, Lurue in that source gets ×2 attacks as she's a 17th level ranger. One would think Nobanion would strike at least as quickly as the Unicorn Queen in melee. They're both Demipowers, and Nobanion has many more warrior levels than Lurue and is the "King of Lions and Strong Beasts" and a "Guardian".</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Cleon, post: 8188818, member: 57383"] Well if Number of Attacks were handled consistently in 2E we wouldn't be having this problem. Early edition D&D's exception-based rules has many charms but ease of interpretation is not one of them! Putting the ×2 last after a closing parenthesis was my preferred solution - as in "(hoof/hoof/horn)×2". I agree that sticking ×2 after each attack is just too clunky. Well it's not just AD&D's Gods that sometimes get their Strength bonus on non-weapon melee range attacks like claws in early editions, there are a few monsters that play by their own rules even in 1E AD&D. The Daemons from [I]Fiend Folio[/I] (1981) and Colchiln from [I]Mordenkainen's Magnificent Adventure[/I] (1984) are the earliest examples that come to mind. The Colchiln was doubly confusing since according to its description in WG5 it has a Strength bonus ON TOP OF a +3 base damage bonus ["[SIZE=3]strengths range from 18/01 to 18/00, but the creatures gain only the +3, +4, +5, or +6 damage bonus (add to the base ld6+3 points of damage)[/SIZE]"] while its encounter in that module has a Dmg stat that is a bit sloppily phrased ["[SIZE=3]Dmg 4-9 per claw, Str 18/75 but with no bonus to hit[/SIZE]"], since it'd be easy to see that 4-9 and think the 1d6+3 is just 1d6 base damage and +3 for its Strength 18/75. If it gets 1d6+3 base damage from its adamantine claws plus +3 for Strength I'd prefer "Dmg 1d6+6 per claw, Str 18/75 but with no bonus to hit" there. Yes, the 2e god-books that came out after [I]Legends & Lore[/I] do become somewhat more consistent in presentation although there are still plenty of glitches - like Nobanion's Avatar in [I]Powers & Pantheons[/I] who's lion form claw/claw/rear claws/bite don't get ×2 attacks despite being a 23rd level paladin and 19th level ranger. As you pointed out, Lurue in that source gets ×2 attacks as she's a 17th level ranger. One would think Nobanion would strike at least as quickly as the Unicorn Queen in melee. They're both Demipowers, and Nobanion has many more warrior levels than Lurue and is the "King of Lions and Strong Beasts" and a "Guardian". [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions
[2e] Monster Mythology Update Project
Top